Interview, Miloš Karadaglić on Baroque (transcript)

Miloš Karadaglić's Baroque (released tomorrow on Sony) marks a 'fresh start' for the Montenegrin guitarist in more ways than one: as well as being his debut project with his new record-label, it's also his first deep dive into Baroque repertoire. Including transcriptions of solo pieces by JS Bach, Rameau, Couperin, Weiss and Scarlatti and movements of concertos by Vivaldi and Marcello (for which Miloš is joined by Arcangelo and Jonathan Cohen), the album was an Editor's Choice in the Awards issue of Gramophone - with reviewer William Yeoman praising the 'obvious chemistry' between soloist and ensemble and the overall sense of 'authentic tenderness for things past'.

Towards the end of September, Miloš spoke to us on video about his mission to 'open up the guitar repertoire to encompass some of the Baroque music which was most exciting to me as a listener' (he counts not only Julian Bream but also Giuliano Carmignola and Cecilia Bartoli among his inspirations here), the joy of crafting these new arrangements together with his beloved mentor Michael Lewin, and how JS Bach's mighty Chaconne in D minor became 'the sun at the heart of this musical solar-system'...

How did your love of baroque repertoire begin?

It was in my student years - that’s when playing Bach was an important part of your growth and the curriculum. And Baroque music always somehow lent itself to the guitar in a very natural way, even though the guitar as we know it today didn’t actually exist at the time! The guitar that did exist in the Baroque period was a much smaller, simpler instrument that had two courses, and it was used in a very different way – mainly to accompany, as the main plucked instrument at the time was the lute.

The lute is a natural instrument to transcribe to the guitar, despite the fact that it had many more strings. But it got a little bit limited to certain composers and certain types of repertoire, and what I wanted to do with this album was to open that up to encompass the Baroque repertoire which was exciting to me as a listener. I would feel my blood boil (in a good way!) when I listened to Giuliano Carmignola playing Vivaldi, or if I think of Cecilia Bartoli’s bravura or Philippe Jaroussky singing Porpora…I looked at all of that incredible music and thought ‘Why is it not possible to bring THIS to the guitar?’

I wanted to see how far I could push the guitar into finding its own Baroque voice, and that was a process I found very exciting and interesting. I’d started out with Baroque as a student through the works of Weiss and Bach and some Scarlatti, but it was always as part of a mixture of things – it never stood on its own, and the only time I played an all-Baroque programme was when I performed the complete lute-suites of Bach. And with this album I got an opportunity to create a fresh start in so many ways: a fresh start with a new label and new people, and a fresh start for me after COVID. I’ve been doing this for a while now - I’m turning 40 years old this year! - and this process allowed me to stand on new ground.

Did you ever study lute or theorbo?

Absolutely not! It was always something I admired other people doing; some of my colleagues today do that, and Julian Bream almost played half-time lute and half-time guitar - it wasn’t an unusual thing at all. But somehow I didn’t have that in me: I feel that the aesthetic of the guitar (and finding that Baroque sound on the guitar) was everything I cared for and everything I wanted. I felt that by changing to another instrument I would open a door – and sometimes you need to know which doors you want to open and which doors you shouldn't open. So my perspective was more from the outside in: it’s about collecting all those influences and bringing them right into the core of the music and of my artistry.

Do you have to make many adjustments to move between Romantic and Baroque repertoire on the guitar, in terms of either technique or the strings you use?

When I started thinking about this album, I had the feeling that there was a lot that I need to change in order to be worthy of the music. I started experimenting with different strings, with changing the way I play, trying to create a different sound and so on and so forth. But somehow that whole process felt like I was walking on very thin ice: whilst going out of your comfort-zone can be a great thing, there has to be a certain feeling of stability underneath it all.

Eventually I realised that the only way that this was going to work is if I took everything that I’d learned from digging deeply into the subject, and then bring it back to my world and my aesthetic, and to the way of playing that has been with me from the beginning. Only then did I arrive at a point where I felt that I was ready to record, and the result was the most wonderful crossing-over of genres that I’ve experienced in my artistic life so far.

How did you enjoy joining forces with Jonathan Cohen and Arcangelo?

I couldn’t have had a better collaborator than Jonny, because he’s literally the kindest, most open, creative and generous man. We met many times to discuss the concertos, and with this repertoire we were in completely new territory because there weren’t any transcriptions - just the originals, and those L’Estro Armonico concertos are particularly challenging because they were written for four violins. Jonny and I worked on distributing the parts between me and the harpsichord, and on bringing out the conversations and dialogues that happen within the piece. Once we’d figured that out together, I went away and worked with Michael Lewin on the guitar part; I wanted to make absolutely sure that we were doing it to add another layer of value to the music, not take anything away.

I was also clear that once we got into the studio I didn’t want to use any multi-tracking - nothing at all. I just wanted it to feel like a proper guitar concerto: somehow it worked, and I’m really thrilled with it!

When did Michael Lewin come into your life?

Michael was my teacher at the Royal Academy of Music; he was the person that met the 17-year-old me, fresh out of Montenegro and completely lost in space, and guided me through that incredible transition. By working with him at the Academy, I really got all the tools I needed to become the best musician that I could be. No-one knows my playing better than Michael, and having his thoughts on this album has been essential – it’s been absolutely wonderful to evolve in that relationship over the years. We’ve worked on other things in the past, but here it was just amazing to see how far we could go.

I’ll give you an example: take a piece like Rameau’s The Arts and the Hours, where there are so many lines happening at the same time…It was originally written for harpsichord, but it’s very often performed on a modern piano where you can use the pedal to sustain those lines - and trying to do that on the guitar with just four fingers is really something! Working on getting into the zone for that with Michael was an incredible artistic process for me: I felt a bit like a swan gliding serenely on the surface, but with all kinds of serious work going on underneath! I’m so grateful to have had these opportunities to venture out of my comfort-zone with Jonny and Michael, and in the studio with our producer Simon Kiln – they gave me the confidence to be vulnerable, and to be myself.

The mighty Chaconne from Bach’s Partita No. 2 in D minor is a daunting prospect for any musician – was that always at the heart of the album?

I originally conceived this as a Baroque album without Bach - Bach was something I wanted to explore as a separate project, because it has its own weight and purpose and meaning. I had Rameau, Couperin, Boccherini, Scarlatti and Weiss: wonderful composers representing different countries around Europe during the Baroque period. I felt like all the planets were gravitating, but they were gravitating like free radicals: they didn’t have a centre! The moment I put the Chaconne at the core of that programme, I felt that I finally had the sun around which all of those planets would orbit.

I’ve had the Chaconne in my fingers for a very long time, and with a piece like this you never feel ready to record. But having gone through the process of establishing that the Baroque repertoire was much bigger and wider than I’d previously assumed, the Chaconne took its natural place in that whole constellation - it has a meaning as both the beginning and the end. That made me feel that the time had finally come to commit it to the tape, and I’m really happy that I was brave enough to do that. It’s a daunting thought that you’re putting a version of this piece out there that will stay for the rest of your life – but it’s a nice feeling when you listen back to the recording and truly feel that this is your Chaconne. At least for now, I wouldn’t change a note about it!